UPDATE - I replaced the previous chart from this original post with the most recent chart from 2008 to show PMAFT exactly what I'm talking about. As you can see, Federal Reserve holdings of the debt are just under 50%.
People can be easily confused when they try to undertake a little research into how and why the economy is in the dumps and we are in the beginning stages of the Great Depression 2.0.
It all looks and sounds so complicated.
But it really isn't...if you know some basic principles to understanding exactly how our system is set up, the answer as to why we are in dire economic straits becomes quite easily discernible.
To put it simply - the reason why we are in a world of economic shit right now is basically and fundamentally caused by changing the CONCEPT of what money is in people's mind.
It used to be that for a person to make a big ticket item purchase, people SAVED their money until they could finally afford it.
Money was something you worked for, earned, and saved to use to acquire the things.
When money was understood to be an exchange certificate for a valuable commodity like gold or silver, people understood that it took a lot of work and effort to earn and save up enough money to buy yourself a big ticket item.
Money = medium of exchange for goods and services. Earn it, save it, and spend it wisely.
That's what it used to mean.
You know what money means nowadays?
Money = DEBT.
Voluntary serfdom, which gives you the illusion of freedom, but keeps you bound to your overlords just as effectively as the Feudal system of the medieval period.
The banks who issue you your credit cards, give you your auto loans and your mortgages, they are establishing a claim to your labor, your efforts, and your very livelihood for the rest of your productive, adult-working life.
Money = Debt is the very foundation of our current system.
But the people in charge, the elite banksters who are in effect our Feudal overlords, have a vested interest in ensuring that most people never see the man behind the curtain, pulling the levers. So, just like their fiat currency is created out of thin air, so too is the reality they seek to portray to the average citizen is a fiat reality - an artificially created "reality" of how the monetary system works.
While I was in the waiting room at the doctor's office the other day, I grabbed an old TIME magazine off the coffee table to read something to pass the time. It was the TIME's Person of the Year 2009 edition, featuring Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke.
In the article, I found a paragraph that basically confirmed that money = debt:
The Fed's central function is its dual mandate to steer the economy toward stable prices and maximum employment through monetary policy. To rev up a weak economy, it can lower interest rates by buying Treasury bonds or other safe securities, essentially printing money and dumping it into the banking system with a mouse click.
There it is folks. This is precisely what FIAT CURRENCY is. Of course, read all 5 pages of the TIME magazine article, you will not find one stray hint or mention of the word FIAT.
So...the Fed "buys Treasury bonds or other safe securities" which results in "printing money and dumping it into the banking system with a mouse click.
What, precisely is being done when the Fed buys Treasury bonds?
Treasury Bonds....future claims to the US Federal treasury. See how this works? The FEDERAL RESERVE "prints" money with a mouse click by buying treasury bonds...certificates redeemable for tax payer money, plus interest in the future.
For example (a very simplified example for the sake of clarity here) If the Fed "buys" a 10 year $100 Treasury Bond for $75 today, "bought" with it's fiat currency ("printed" with a mouse click), that represents a debt of the principle plus 25% interest the American tax payer "owes" the federal reserve in 10 years.
You know how you always here about the public debt in the news media? What you never hear is who exactly owns this debt and how much. The Federal Reserve is often called "Quasi-Governmental agency" and the debt owed to them for their "fiat currency mouse-click printing" services is officially called "Intra-governmental debt. This is a half-truth -- the most effective lies always contain some truths to it -- because the real truth is that the central banks that make up the system in the US are privately owned. It's only "quasi-governmental" because it was created by the 16th amendment to the US Constitution - the Federal Reserve Act signed into law by Woodrow Wilson in 1913. If you read The Creature From Jekyll Island, you'll learn about how the guys behind the 16th amendment were the same guys connected to the same guys behind feminism and women's studies (the Rockefellers, Warburgs, and Rothschilds). This is precisely why I believe in the "conspiracy theory of history."
So how much do We the Sheeple owe the Federal Reserve for their mouse-clicking services?
3.851 trillion dollars of the national debt is owed to the Federal Reserve...45% of the estimated 8 trillion dollars of debt.
Got that, folks? Almost half of the "national debt" that you always hear about in the mainstream media news is owed to the Federal Reserve for their mouse click printing services. Our money is debt based from it's very source. Every time the Fed "prints" money, we owe them interest for their "service."
The moment the Federal Reserve "prints" any more money, the national debt increases.
Money = Debt is our systemic reality.
So who is our 21st century Feudal overlords? Those who own our debt.
Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes her laws. - Mayer Amschel Rothschild
21 comments:
Do you believe that if Ron Paul gets elected (I hope he's up for candidacy this year), that this will be abolished?
What I fear is that he will be elected, the system will FAIL naturally as the current stress of the debt will then implode (the current regime will stall this from happening until they leave, so it won't look like it's their fault to the ignorant masses) and it will once again be FREEDOM that is blamed for a financial disaster.
But if Ron Paul has a planned timeline of dismantling the fed, I'm all for hearing it.
3.851 trillion dollars of the national debt is owed to the Federal Reserve...45% of the estimated 8 trillion dollars of debt.
First, those debt numbers are way out of date. Second, intragovernmental debt is debt held by the Medicare Trust Fund, Social Security Trust Fund, & the Federal Financing Back not the Federal Reserve.
This was an excellent post.
Ron Paul will NEVER be elected; he'll NEVER win the Republican nomination, because the Banksters won't let him.
HL, sounds like you've been reading Mary Croft, among others. It's mind blowing.
emarel
HL, sounds like you've been reading Mary Croft, among others.
Have you gotten to the part where she starts talking BS about Schumann resonances and the year 2012? It's really funny. My favorite parts have to be her inability to read basic English used in various laws and her use of David Icke quotes which is an endorsement of his ideas that the world is run by reptile aliens.
PM/AFT
-Reptile alien, Grand High Commander of the Illuminati/New World Order, and Supreme Overlord of Earth a.k.a. The Man a.k.a. The guy that's oppressing all of you (That's for all you conspiracy theorists out there)
Amateur Strat - I don't believe Ron Paul is electable. His campaign platform makes it a virtual certainty that the Republican machine will NEVER allow him to capture the nomination...and he will never have serious coverage in the mainstream, corporate owned press.
First, those debt numbers are way out of date. Second, intragovernmental debt is debt held by the Medicare Trust Fund, Social Security Trust Fund, & the Federal Financing Back not the Federal Reserve.
Yes, the numbers are out of date...they've gotten worse. I used them simply because of the accompanying pie chart showing the percentage of debt makes a simplified, easily understood picture to highlight my primary point.
The 2.777 trillion in the pie chart represents the entitlement spending part of the public debt...32%.
In other words, while "Intra-governmental debt" is often the combined total of the entitlement spending and Fed Reserve debt, if you break it down..."we" owe the Federal Reserve more for their "mouse-click printing" services than we owe for promised entitlement spending. Conservatives love to bitch about entitlement spending (and I agree on that much), but the entire issue of the Federal Reserve and their unconstitutional exercise of cash "printing" power drives a bigger part of our debt than the socialism programs. But the GOP, other than Ron Paul, simply never talk about this.
emarel, I've never read Mary Croft..never heard of her.
The 2.777 trillion in the pie chart represents the entitlement spending part of the public debt...32%.
No it doesn't. The pie graph is wrong.
There are three categories of government debt.
1. Intragovernmental debt. This is dominated by the Social Security and Medicare trust funds. It also includes money various government agencies have to hold on to but that is so small so that's insignificant. On your pie graph that is incorrectly called federal reserve debt.
2. Debt held by the US public. This includes all government debt sold to private citizens of the US and private institutions in the US such as pension funds, mutual funds, etc. Savings bonds are in this category. This is the U.S. public part of your chart.
3. Debt held by foreigners. This is debt held by foreign governments and other non-US entities. This is the foreign owned part of your pie chart.
you break it down..."we" owe the Federal Reserve more for their "mouse-click printing" services than we owe for promised entitlement spending
No we don't. Debt owned by the fed is not included as intragovernmental debt ever. The Fed can't profit from the interest on any government debt it may buy since the Fed is required to hand over any profits to the US Treasury.
The Fed is a bad idea for the same reasons that Amtrak is a bad idea but that's it.
@AS: Ron Paul is Illuminati. The controlled opposition. Forget him.
They are crashing the financial system. This 'rebound' is complete nonsense. If Tim Turner and the guys at the Guardian of the Free Republics are not successful I don't see anyone else on the horizon that might be. Time for men to look after themselves.
PMAFT - Look at the most recent, found on Wikipedia:
Because there is a large variety of people who own the notes, bills, and bonds in the "public" portion of the debt, the U.S. Treasury also publishes information which groups the types of holders by a few, general categories to get a good picture of who owns United States debt. In this data set, some of the public portion is moved and combined with the total government portion because this amount is owned by the Federal Reserve as part of United States monetary policy. (See Federal Reserve System)
As is apparent from the chart, a little less than half of the total national debt is owed to the "Federal Reserve and intragovernmental holdings".
Oh yeah, as for "return profits" that's another red herring when you consider the following: all expenses, salaries, operating costs are paid by tax dollars, AND a yearly 6% dividend is paid out to all stockholders. (Gee, call it a "dividend" and suddenly that's not "profit?" Think 6% of the massive holdings is nothing to sneeze at?) THAN the rest is "returned to the treasury."
PMAFT, I know you think anything remotely considered "conspiracy theory" is all crazy...but I'm not posting a damn thing about aliens, reptiles or "illuminati" here. Everything I've posted on this thread is verifiable from other sources.
Some basic facts for you to consider: The Federal Reserve has NO CONSTITUTIONAL AUTHORITY to 'print' money for the country. That authority is SPECIFICALLY designated to the Congress...and the Congress does not have the power to delegate that authority to a 3rd party.
Finally, everything that the central banks do - fiat currency and fractional reserve lending - all contribute towards these bubble creations and steady inflation, eating away the value of the dollar.
sad thing is, living without debt means you are materialistically "poor" compared to your neighbors - waiting to buy toys, homes, whatever until you can actually afford it. and even if you make this sacrifice, the money Uncle Sam extorts from you is used to bail them out. those who stay in the matrix are rewarded. hard to say what I hate more, paying medical bills for people who eat themselves into sickness, or paying bailout bills. guess the best way thru is to pay as little tax as possible, and write it off as a loss.
Let's run the numbers. You picked June 2008 so I pulled the debt numbers for 6/30/2008 from Treasury Direct. I pulled these numbers from this page:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np
and put in a date of 6/30/2008.
Here are the numbers:
Total Debt: $9,492,006,123,003.80
Debt held by the Public: $5,285,063,693,378.25
Intragovernmental Holdings: $4,206,942,429,625.55
We agree that Intragovernmental Holdings are the Social Security Trust Fund, Medicare Trust Fund, Federal Financing Bank, and other government agencies. Since Treasury Direct does not say Federal Reserve Held Debt plus Intragovernmental Holdings they do not combine them.
Let's do some basic math. Multiple the percentage from your chart of Fed Reserve Plus Intragovernmental Holdings by the total debt:
49.37% * $9,492,006,123,003.80 =
.4937 * $9,492,006,123,003.80 =
$4,686,203,422,926.98
This means that Federal Reserve Held Debt plus Intragovernmental Holdings is $4,686,203,422,926.98.
Let's get what just is debt held by the Fed by subtracting Intragovernmental Holdings from that number:
$4,686,203,422,926.98
- $4,206,942,429,625.55
-----------------------
$ 479,260,993,301.43
IOW the Fed holds a little less than half a trillion dollars of government debt, A WHOPPING 5% OF GOVERNMENT DEBT!!!! So much for the three and a half trillion the Fed supposedly has.
PMAFT, I know you think anything remotely considered "conspiracy theory" is all crazy...but I'm not posting a damn thing about aliens, reptiles or "illuminati" here. Everything I've posted on this thread is verifiable from other sources.
Instead of going to "other sources" why not get the numbers from the original source and do some basic math like I did? Your "other sources" made claims such as the Fed holding 3.5 trillion dollars of government debt that was disproven by basic math.
Yes, I think its crazy when it fails basic math (or lacks evidence).
The Federal Reserve has NO CONSTITUTIONAL AUTHORITY to 'print' money for the country. That authority is SPECIFICALLY designated to the Congress...and the Congress does not have the power to delegate that authority to a 3rd party.
Has the Supreme Court said this? They are in charge of interpreting the Constitution. If they haven't ruled on this then get some lawyers to argue the case before the SC.
The Federal Reserve isn't a "third party". The Fed Board of Governors is an agency of the US government. It's "independent" like the Post Office. Third parties don't have their upper management picked by politicians. Third parties aren't required to hand over all their profits to the US Treasury. Third parties can't be directly ordered by Congress to focus of things like "maximum employment".
a yearly 6% dividend is paid out to all stockholders. (Gee, call it a "dividend" and suddenly that's not "profit?" Think 6% of the massive holdings is nothing to sneeze at?) THAN the rest is "returned to the treasury."
About 95% of the Fed's net earnings go to the US Treasury and this has been consistent since 1914. Last year the US Treasury received 45 billion dollars from the Fed which is significantly more than the total profits of any bank, much less just the dividend the banks received from the Fed.
"emarel, I've never read Mary Croft..never heard of her."
Well HL, here's her book. Recommended by Globalman. See what she has to say. some of it is a little woo-woo, but hey, she might be correct about the banksters.
http://www.spiritualeconomicsnow.net/solutions/How_I_08.pdf
emarel
Whether you're right or not, the issue remains - whenever the Fed "prints" money, it is basically adding to the "public debt."
If you want to believe that the Federal Reserve is all on the up and up, and that "bailouts" and the escalating public debt is all normal...that's your prerogative.
Just understand that The Fed "returns" it's profit to the Treasury is nothing more than a diversion.
Just as a non-profit CEO can live in a mansion, drive a luxury car and live the high life...and find a way to make all of that "operational expenses" so too is the Fed conning the country with it's dog and pony show.
A 6% dividend paid out to shareholders is far more $$$ than they supposedly "return" to the treasury.
Whether you're right or not
If you want to prove me wrong than come up with hard numbers that pass basic math. As you pointed out no one is making claims about reptile aliens or the Illuminati. We're dealing with hard numbers that are published and available to anyone.
A 6% dividend paid out to shareholders is far more $$$ than they supposedly "return" to the treasury.
Then prove it with hard numbers and double check it with basic math. The banks we are talking about are publically traded corporations. What they made from their Federal Reserve shares is not a secret.
PMAFT - The math doesn't matter as much as the basic principle - the Federal Reserve has undue influence over the entire nation, and their fiat currency and fractional reserve lending are part of the problem.
Every time they "print" money, they put the nation further and further into debt.
It's a never ending escalation of debt...which is the entire point to begin with.
Our monetary system is based on money created out of thin-air, and this creation adds increasing debt on the American taxpayer.
I came here from PMAFT.
I think both Hawaiian Libertarian and PMAFT are using pretty loose standards of argument. If we cite sources like WIkipedia, the whole exercise degenerates pretty quickly into a shouting match.
I think PMAFT should be applauded for attempting to bring some rigor into the debate with his numerical calculations, but I think the arguments on both sides should be scrapped. There doesn't seem to be much real communication, and neither side seems likely to convince the other of anything substantial.
Hawaiian Libertarian deserves credit for a graceful back-pedal on the chart issue, but it's still a back-pedal. The only way to avoid similar retractions in the future is to be more rigorous.
I think both HL and PMAFT are essentially allies in the same cause, so I don't want to see either one attach too much importance to this squabble.
I think both HL and PMAFT are essentially allies in the same cause,
We are...which is why we both contribute to the Spearhead.
But I think this has been a civil and worthwhile debate to have.
Afterall, as a proponent of "conspiracy theory" I most certainly should be able to stand criticisms and critiques of the issues I am arguing for.
One of the things I've repeatedly written is that I believe a lot of "conspiracy" theory on the internet is diluted and polluted by purposeful mis and dis information...but that the truth can be gleaned from the large volume of "conspiracy" theory out there.
Which is why you will never find my discussions on the topic to focus on the more fantastic and exotic theories regarding the illuminati, reptilian aliens, UFOs, etc.
But in terms of the international banksters that have subverted our country, are working towards implementing a one world government, and the social engineers that have financed and supported the feminist movement to destroy the nuclear family and make as many people as possible dependent on the State? I believe the evidence of "Conspiracy" behind these things are overwhelming and undeniable if you do enough research into it.
PMAFT. The fed pretends to be a part of the 'guvment'. It's not. And even it if was the 'guvment' is nothing but a bunch of crooks anyway. They don't represent the people you think the do. The represent the owners of the USA. The banksters.
The book by G Edward Griffin explains the whole thing in just 600 pages.
That ignorant people dismiss 'conspiracy theories' so readily is a joke because that just means they are ingorant. Once one understands what is really going on the idea that is it NOT a conspiracy is laughable. It's real simple. The Illuminati genetically engineered people to be slaves and then told them they are diving beings created by 'God' to help make sure they never 'woke up'. Money is one more control tool. Once you understand how it works you can see it is a control tool. That's why 'death and taxes' are the only two sure things in life. Taxes are their way of living as parasites.
Hmmm....PMAFT: I haven't fully looked into the "Central Banking is Rothschild Property" thing, but definitely, when lizard people come into play, I start getting serious doubts.
What's your take on this? Because central banking, at least of paper currency and various fractional schemes, has been implemented around the world. These theories sound plausible, but I'd have to do my own research.
Blegh,
start here then.
http://www.the-spearhead.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=42
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