Friday, April 22, 2011

All Apologies

Game blogger Shark, over at Solve My Girl Problems, wrote a post about What to do if you cheat on your girlfriend.

He makes some great points about apologizing that reminded me of one of the things I figured out after gaining an understanding of this thing we call game: When you know you genuinely did something wrong, and you feel your wife or girlfriend deserves an authentic apology, there are two ways to go about it - one way will damage her attraction for you, and one that won't.

It's all about maintaining your frame, even when you concede you are wrong.

As Shark points out:

If you stand hypnotized with despair and simply retort apologies in different languages, you only back-up her ability to shit test you. It’s hard to explain fully, but whenever you apologize to a girl take notice that she will USE IT as leverage. This isn’t because they are inherently imbued with demonic qualities, it’s because all women have a feminine prerogative to maximize male utility. When a guy apologizes for something, he admits that he was wrong – something that he CANNOT retract. It becomes her free ticket to establishing and reinforcing feminine social conventions like shame and super-monogamy (Oneitis). The more you apologize for cheating, the more you subconsciously reinforce within her mind that SHE WAS RIGHT, YOU WERE WRONG, YOU NEED TO BE PUNISHED, JUSTICE MUST BE DELIVERED, etc.


This theory applies to a lot more than just big issues like cheating.

I'm sure every guy in a long term relationship with a female has encountered the recitation of "the list" of past transgressions for which she has never forgotten.

This is because you're abject apologies have beta-ized you in her eyes, and beta's are contemptible creatures as perceived through the lens of female hypergamy. Admitting your wrongdoings (whatever they may be, from minor transgressions to major, potentially relationship destroying ones) and apologizing profusely for them, is not the path to forgiveness and healing. It's the path to betaization and putting her up on a pedestal for which she is now looking DOWN on you.

If you done wrong, and you feel the need to apologize for it, you need to maintain the alpha frame. If you must say sorry, you must say it without being sorry. In other words, you cannot project abject submission to her anger, even if that anger is justifiable.

Think of it like a firm Father telling his young daughter that he's sorry he cannot take her to the shopping mall like he originally told her he would, because an emergency came up at work. The attitude you should project is "I'm sorry dear, it can't be helped."

If you must apologize, say it once. Say it clearly. Apologize without being apologetic, than never bring it up again...and never, ever ask her for forgiveness. By doing that, you are placing yourself beneath her, and while she may even say she forgives you, she really won't. That act of submission to her anger and pleading for approval will only ensure that you've just added another incident to her list of past transgressions to be wielded on you in the future.

So what to do if you are that guy who always finds himself overwhelmed and on the losing end of arguments once that list of past transgressions comes out?

Many guys when confronted with past transgressions will either apologize again for those admitted wrongs, or get angry and blow up..."I already apologized to you for that! Why can't you let it go?!?!!"

This just makes things worse. Intellectually, on a conscious level, she may even have forgiven you for your actual transgression...but subconsciously she has not forgiven you for a far greater transgression - you beta-ized when you apologized.

So what to do if you're one of these guys that always finds himself losing arguments with your wife or girlfriend because she has the list of past transgressions to wield on you whenever a disagreement turns into an emotionally driven confrontation?

You must simply refuse to discuss it and maintain your frame and keep the argument focused on the topic at hand.

"The past is the past, and I'm not going to waste time going over that again."

Another way to deal with "the list" is to simply end the conversation the moment she brings it up. "This conversation is over." Than remove yourself from her presence.

Do that a few times, and she figures out that "the list" is no longer an effective weapon to use against you in an argument, and she won't use it anymore. The more effective the list of past transgressions is for her in arguing with you, the longer that list is going to continue to grow, contributing to a steady sense of discontent in her view of your relationship.


Dan in Philly said...

What great advice. I can certainly vouch for the truth in these words, in case anyone doubts. Who I once was thought if I showed my woman how bad I felt, she would surely take pity and forgive me. The more she rubbed it in, the more I showed how bad I felt, and the more I showed how bad I felt, the more she rubbed it in. I nearly went insaine with frustration before I realized that I simply had to change my approach.

Now when I make a mistake, I don't mind owning up to it. I treat these as if I made a wrong turn when driving us somewhere. Yes, I see that I made this mistake, but I'm not going to make a big deal about it and I don't expect you to, either. If she goes off into hysterical yammering, I tune it out for a while, then rebuke her if she takes it too far.

If she later brings up "the list of past errors" I'll generally treat it all like it's a big joke, and laugh and say "wasn't that a good one?"

This has been like a magic spell on our relationship. I don't get emotionally upset about being wrong, and gradually she stopped getting upset, too.

Flahute said...

Yes, to all this. I learned the hard way. You are doing a great service to men by explaining this.

I haven't said "I'm sorry" in the longest time and don't know that I ever will. I only go so far as to admit that I could have done something better, rather than I did something wrong. The goal is to keep your frame, and get her to move on and get over it by demonstrating your strength, i.e. your oak tree solidness. Never open yourself to being shamed by her. She will feel that as weak in her hindbrain.

ElectricAngel said...

Ah, another classic, HL. I have dealt with the list of grievances with "This conversation is over." I think DiP's approach of, "Yeah, that was a good one" is even better. Will be using that!

black said...

It's amazing how right-on 90% of "game" is.

Another great one is the way women try to get their guy to feel like they have to help them DO things. Like finding keys. "Where ARE my keys?!" I'll admit, I used to fall for that. Now, I let her storm around the house until she finds them. She's getting better... :-).

It's amazing how many guys are like me... just trying to do the "right thing". When the "right thing" is the WRONG THING.

Anonymous said...

"I'm sure every guy in a long term relationship with a female has encountered the recitation of "the list" of past transgressions for which she has never forgotten."

LOL, my mom did that all the time to me when I was a kid. Sometimes she still tries it. I used a form of "agree and amplify" on her back then, though I didn't know that's what it was.

Was it Disraeli who said "never apologize, never explain"? It's as true now as it was in the 1800s.

Workshy Joe said...

Yes, it doesn't have to be something huge like cheating.

Even small apologies for trivia can cause trouble.

The trick is to be matter-of-fact.

"This is what happened in the past. This is what will happen in the future."

**** ***** said...

i should write a guest post on this. i've cheated on my girlfriend(s) so many times it boggles the mind. i've been caught red-handed so many times it doesn't even make sense.

apologizing or explaining isn't even important. it's how you handle the actual getting caught, if you beg and plead she will VERY likely walk away, and if nothing else, she will make you FUCKING pay for having strayed, depending how vindictive she is fuck other guys JUST to get back at you.....

DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT fucking apologize in the form of pleading for forgiveness etc.

MARK my words from someone who sadly, is a cold, callous, rake and expert in this area

**** ***** said...

ever seen a little kid fall down?
if you rush over and ask how hurt they are, if they're okay...the kid soaks it up ans cries.

Or you walk over, tell them to get up, tell them they're fine, and are not even truly acknowledging their needless hysterics...they walk it off and life continues on much more quickly and sooner.

Kathy Farrelly said...

"i've cheated on my girlfriend(s)
so many times it boggles the mind"

I find that very sad. Why have a girlfriend if you are intent on cheating? It is not fair to her.. Let her find someone who values fidelity.

If my husband cheated(and I know that he would not, I trust him implicitly) I would be devastated...We share a deep and loving bond.
To share such an intimate act with another woman.?? shakes head..

He belongs to me, and I to him..
The thought of him putting his penis in another woman would kill me..

My first marriage ended due to infidelity on my husband's part.

I could take the gambling and the drinking.. But.. Not... That..

Kathy Farrelly said...

"ever seen a little kid fall down?
if you rush over and ask how hurt they are, if they're okay...the kid soaks it up ans cries."

The mind boggles at such a trite and inane analogy..

Anonymous said...

Kathy, boyfriend =/= husband. He has not sworn an oath of fidelity to his girlfriend. If she sticks with him in spite of his cheating, then she does not, in fact, value fidelity at all, and deserves what she gets.

paige said...

It depends on the severity of the transgression. If he has done something so terrible that it could lead to the end of a marriage then her self-respect and sense of security will not allow her to forgive and forget if she does not see some evidence of genuine contriteness.

Anonymous said...

Admit nothing, deny everything.

Anonymous said...

As Bill Clinton said, "Mistakes were made."

Anonymous said...

There's a follow-up over at Delusion Damage you've probably seen.

These two posts have made me realize that feeling bad for making mistakes, whether those mistakes were inadvertent or deliberate transgressions is an indulgence and a bad habit.

I learned guilt and shame at mistakes from my parents, who were using these emotions to try to modify my behavior. But I'm an adult now, and these feelings do nothing whatsoever beneficial for either me or whomever I've wronged. I'll either change my behavior or not. Feeling guilty won't itself change my behavior. Turns out, having these feelings is a mistake.

As a bonus, if I can break my habit of indulging in guilt upon mistakes, an "Alpha apology" will be totally honest, authentic and congruent.

Thanks Keoni.

Keoni Galt said...

Thanks Anon for the link to Delusion Damages excellent piece!

His insights on this topic are excellent:

The difference between a beta apology and an alpha apology is very simple: a beta apology is outcome-dependent – you are asking her for something, you are putting her in a position of power, submitting to her judgment, hanging your hopes on her response. An alpha apology is outcome-independent – you are telling her something, you are keeping your position of power, holding onto your authority, and her response does not matter to you.

Precisely. But DD makes an even better point later:

No matter how serious the transgression, there is never a reason to ask for forgiveness. Forgiveness is not the point. By asking for forgiveness you are trying to use the other person’s response to make yourself feel better – you are trying to take something. By informing the other person that the damage you caused was not intentional, you are trying to make the other person feel better – you are trying to give something. Whether they take it or not is irrelevant to the fact that you made an effort to help them.

shannonstoney said...

The reason apologies don't make me feel better as a woman is that I sense often that they are insincere. Now I know that I was right. My partner let his children abuse and threaten me. He sort of apologized. They did it again. He sort of apologized again. If this is a game, i've had enough of it.